Kerrang! Interview - 28/4/2010

[Subliminal]

I'm on my way to work but i thought I'd share a littile quote from the interview by Chino regarding the leak (I'll do a full write up later).

Diamond Heist

Diamond Eyes leaked onto the Internet before it's scheduled release date of May 17th, forcing Deftones to put it out early and Chino wasn't happy...

"I care, I think about the fact we worked hard for this" he says "this record was a big chance for us. What leaked I thought, 'okay, let me look for it then' I found it in 5 minutes and downloaded it three minutes later for free. I thought, 'wow I worked on this for three years, pretty much, and in three minutes some one can just download it for free"

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On November 4 2008 Life for the Deftones changed forever when bassist Chi Cheng was left in a coma after a car accident. 18 Months on, the band are returning with a new album and a stronger bond, but they've walked through the darkness to get here...

The Sun Also Rises

When the news came through, it was devastating. Chi Cheng, Deftones' bass player, had been seriously injured in a car crash. Not wearing a seat belt, he had been thrown from the wreckage and across the highway in Santa Clara, California, suffering major head injuries in the process. He was lucky - if lucky is a word that applies here - that some off-duty medical staff were passing the scene. It was probably the immediate treatment they gave him on the roadside that means he is still alive. However, the 39-year old is a long way from being present. Chi went into a coma that day, November 4, 2008 from which he has not yet fully emerged. Still just semi-conscious he has had millions of dollars of medical care but still, when his bandmates visit, he shows not a flicker of recognition. The lights behind his eyes won't spark into life - though they know he can hear them as they tell the old jokes with heavy hearts.

It was an accident that jarred Deftones' world. First there was the fact that the man they refer to as their ''brother'' was no longer beside them. For 20 years, the other four members of the Deftones had been used to looking over to his spot on the stage and seeing his reassuring presence. They had been used to walking past his bunk on the tour bus, hearing his stories, and including him in all they do. Now when they look, he's not there. But there was another reason it knocked the band from their axis. After years of deteriorrating relationships between the five of them, slowly things had seemed to be getting back onto an even keel. Life in Deftones was fun again for the first time in 10 years. Then tragedy tried to take that away.

The bands singer, Chino Moreno believes the rot started setting in when Deftones were recording 2000's White Pony. He believes they had slowly become ''unfocussed'', ''lacklustre'' and ''unconnected''. When he talks, in musical terms, about two of the subsequent albums they released, 2003's Deftones and 2006's Saturday Night Wrist, he says, ''I don't know what I was thinking''. The latter, the band's fifth record, took them nearly three-and-a-half years to finish. Chino says he and guitarist Stef Carpenter, were not communicating; instead one would create music in one sphere, while the other would create in a different one. When it came time to record, he says they would simply mash their ideas together.

But all that had changed. After touring Saturday Night Wrist, they had somehow rediscovered the spirit and bond they shared when the band first formed in the late '80s. The old friendships were back, the camaraderie had returned and, crucially, the creativity was rampant. They had been in the studio, with Chi, recording what should have been their sixth album - Eros. It was experimental, Stef says he was influenced by the R&B dance music of The Neptunes and Timbaland and wanted to create club-like grooves over their heavy riffs. ''I don't think I necessarily achieved it,'' he says with a shrug, ''But those songs are all great''. Chino says Eros was sounding psychedelic, that Deftones had pushed themselves out to the bounds of their imagination and had returned with new, jamming-inspired sounds. ''There was a really good vibe'' he says. ''We had reconnected as friends and as a band. We were all in a super-tight place. We were all in it together again.'' and then, suddenly, their newfound world was torn apart. Or was it?

The Sunset Marquis Hotel , nestled discreetly just off Los Angeles' Sunset Strip is perhaps one of the world's nicer places. On a warm day in California, as relaxed waiters offer out menus and hotel guests lounge by the pool, its casual luxury, sun-blushed charm and elegant cool seem a million miles from that tragic day a year and a half ago when both Chino and Stef received the news about Chi. It is at this hotel, though, that the pair are to meet Kerrang! to talk about how they set about rebuilding their band since the accident. Drummer Abe Cunningham, keyboardist Frank Delagado, and new bassist Sergio Vega have been spared interview duty. And perhaps, after all, it is not such an inappropriate place because, as the sunshine diffuses down through the palms above, so Deftones have found light from the darkness in which they once found themselves. For the story of what the band did after Chi's accident is one of rising from the ashes. Because Deftones are back on their feet again and, as they are only too keen to make clear, stronger than ever.

When Chino comes wandering out to the hotel's outdoor restaurant, his wife and bouncing young daughter beside him, his appearance requires a double take. Where once he had seemed resigned to letting himself go, his weight meaning he could perhaps politely be described as padded, now he is slim and very healthy looking. He seems fit, cheekbones cut across his face, there's a vigorous glow to his skin, and his clothes no longer come in XXL sizes. He has a smile and a positvity about him. He looks good. ''Thank you, man'' he says, when you tell him as much, ''I'm getting my head together. I'm getting my brain and my body together and that means everything just comes easier. Waking up in the morning is better and I sleep better, I live better and I feel better''.

His guitarist, Stef, is always late according to those who work with him. It's a surprise, then, when he rolls up 15 minutes early. He's come straight from the golf course after a quick nine holes. He's fretting today about his handicap dropping down to a still respectable eight. It seems unfair, on an afternoon where both seem so buoyant, to bring up the incident that has brought them to this place- Chi's accident - but both acknowledge that they may not be here at all, were it not for that disaster. Because, eventually, from the tragedy came optimism. ''When it happened it was a wake up call for us as a band and in life in general'' says Chino. ''It made us re-evaluate what we're doing and why we're doing this.'' It's clear Chi is still in both of their minds, though each has been dealing with the situation in different ways. Chino and Abe spent last weekend with their bass player, speaking to him though he can't speak back.

''He's doing better. He looked good'' says Chino. ''His body is healing and he looks healthy in that respect. It's hard to say what kind of damage he has because he's not speaking yet. When I was talking to him, he was staring right at me and you look into his eyes and it seems as though he's in there. But it's hard when you don't get any expression from him. You'll say something funny and his expression doesn't change. You expect him to smile, laugh or even just blink his eyes. So that's hard. I miss him a lot. It's still tough, it's still really tough. It's pretty raw''

Stef, though, has only been to see Chi once - shortly after the crash. He finds it hard to think about his friend in his current condition. '' I haven't seen him in a long time because I think I'm still in denial about it'' he says. ''I don't want to see him like that. I don't want to think about him being laid out because that's not the way I want to picture him. I don't want to picture him being that way forever. One day I know I'm going to get a call from him. He'll just say, 'Hi, fucker' and I'll be like, 'Shit, it's about time!' ''


When the accident happened, Deftones had nearly completed Eros. It was the first record they had made together in nearly 10 years on which, as Chino tells it, they had all enjoyed themselves. There had been deep problems before. ''On the last couple of records, I've wondered what was the purpose of us making music'' says Chino. ''It seemed that there was so much drama to finish a record, there were so many obstacles. A lot of them were self-generated - there was lack of communication and so many little things. I remember telling myself when we were finishing the Saturday Night Wrist record that I don't know if I want to make another Deftones record because it has to be one of the most stressful, unhealthy experiences ever. It used to be fun.'' One of the issues was the difficult creative relationship between Chino and Stef. The frontman says that, at times in the past, they had been trying to outdo each other.

''Maybe we were a little competitive'' he says. ''Perhaps we were trying to prove ourselves to each other. Instead of building on top of each other, Stef and I were building two separate things and then trying to mash them together. It worked to an extent - the records didn't turn out horrible - but is it the essence of what we're trying to do? I don't think so'' There was also a control issue. Chino is quite a tightly wound charater and he admits he thinks too much. He felt that if he wasn't driving the band forward, making things happen, then the chances were high that Deftones just wouldn't focus. It's a theory that gains more credence on meeting Stef. The guitarist has a laidback attitude, expounding pot-spun theories and calling himself ''the anti-hype person in the band''. In fact, his attitude to songs is unusual for a man who makes his living from them: ''In six months time, after we release a record, it will be dead anyway. They're just songs. I'm not married to them, they're a dime a dozen to me''

''On the last couple of records, I had been organising our ideas'' says Chino. ''I'm sure it pissed [the band] off because it probably seemed like I was coming in and dictating. I'm sure it was frustrating for them and it was taxing on my brain too.'' But that hadn't been the case on Eros. The songs had been born from jams and had come together naturally, if a little untidily. ''In the Eros sessions we were getting along really well. Everyone was having fun. The only thing we were lacking was a little focus'' says Chino. ''We would come into the studio at about eight o'clock at night, then we'd sit around and play cards for an hour, or play dice, dominoes or talk bullshit'' The old gang, it seemed was back. But then Chi's car crash forced them to reconsider the record and their future. ''So we stood back for a few months, put everything onto the backburner and, then we reconvened to talk about what we wanted to do'' says Chino. ''We said 'Do we want to finish this record or do we continue on? What do we do?' '' - '' I said we should start over as a whole new band'' says Stef. ''I thought we should have a new name and start all over again. When everything happened with Chi's accident, out of respect I didn't think we should put [Eros] out. But now, I think it should come out to help him and his family''


What helped them make the decision to continue - and to shelve Eros indefinitely - was getting back in a room and playing music. So they called their old friend and former Quicksand bassist, Sergio Vega, and met in ther Sacramento studio. ''It was the first time we had all been in the same room together since Chi's accident'' says Chino. ''To even be in that room together without Chi was a big thing. but it was also a really special thing. I felt closer to all these guys than I'd felt to them in 10 years. It wasn't about writing anything new, we just wanted to play. It was very theraputic. At the end of the rehearsal we sat down and I said, 'How do you guys feel about writing some more music?'. It wasn't even about writing a new record, it was about trying to pour what we were going through into something. I looked at it like starting a new chapter. Eros is sacred and special to us and, at this point, it's the last thing that Chi has played on, but I really felt like looking forward. After the first two weeks, we had about eight songs. On the last few records, it too us a year to get that much material. And it happened naturally, it was great.''

Chino had issues with Eros, enjoying it's experimental edge but fearing its songwriting was too muddled. He wanted to improve that on what would become their new album, Diamond Eyes. At least part of the reason for that was because had come to a startling realisation. ''We needed to save our career'' he says. ''To be completely honest, I feel that if we had put out Eros, it could have been the end of our career. That's not because the record's terible but we were still a little unfocussed and people could easily have written us off. In fact, I think a lot of people are on the fence with us at this point'' Why did he feel this about his band? ''I think our lacklustre attitude was showing. There were times I went onstage and, because of my weight, my health and the way I felt, I didn't want to go out there. I'd have been drinking and, because I was drunk, I wouldn't remember shit. I was just getting through it and that was it. I think people still expect a certain amount of quality from us and I don't think the Eros record had that essence and quality''

So they started work on Diamond Eyes, and despite the fun, confidence and creativity they discovered once again, there was still guilt that they were doing this while their friend lay on a hospital bed. ''Yes, I think that [guilt] was there,'' says Chino, who also admits Chi's family may have been unhappy too. ''I imagine [their] initial feeling was that they probably weren't too happy with us. I imagine they thought, 'How could they be doing this'. I can imagine they felt a little unsure about it.'' However Chino and Stef recently had a long chat with Chi's mother about the situation and they feel it is no longer an issue. ''She really opened up to us and was really understanding'' says Chino. ''He's in our minds constantly. We're not being disloyal. This is something we had no control over. Also, it has affected us pretty big too. We've had to rebuild our whole infrastructure and it feels as though we're still doing that. In a way, it feels as if we're starting over again, it feels as though we have to prove ourselves as a band again.''

In writing and recording Diamond Eyes, Deftones rediscovered the art of working together and, in doing so, have recorded their strongest album since White Pony. It helped that, as Stef says, their new bassist ''Just fitted right in, it was as though he'd been in the band forever'' And with that in place, Deftones turned to each other and music as support. ''As soon as we all got together in a room, we got a powerful feeling where we knew we still had each other'' says Chino. ''We knew we still had an opportunity  to do something good. And then we did it. We did what we said we were going to do. There was a lot of stuff that we had to deal with. Through it all, though, I can honestly say this was one of the most fun records I was involved in making - thought that's probably hard for anyone to believe given the situation'' Rather than the one-upmanship that had marked their last few albums, the band were pulling in the same direction. ''Every day [Stef] would come in with three or four ideas'' he says. ''He'd pick up his guitar, start playing and creativity would pour out of him, that inspired me right away. But instead of him coming up with an idea and me trying to work out the next part [as had happened previously] I would work out a vocal part for the idea he had. That, in turn, would inspire him to go on to write the next part of the song. There was a constant building process that was very immediate. It really sounds like a cliche but it was a case of us going back to our roots and doing things how we did them in the beginning. We went into a room together, had fun playing our instruments and came up with songs from nothing again. It was a good feeling''

It's why when you see Deftones now, they exude positivity despite the painful process they have been through. Because it took Chi's accident to reveal that they are still a band of brothers. It took tragedy to bring things into context. And with priorities made clear, Deftones are once again making music in which they believe. Chi is still there, in their hearts and in their heads, but they're moving on. For the first time in a long time, though, they're all doing that in the same direction. ''Optimistic is a good word. I'm optimistic about the future of this band'' says Chino ''We're in a better place than we've been in years and years. Despite the dark cloud that is over our heads. But we're grateful that we have each other, we have our health and we're happy we're able to do this. Just realising that is the key. It feels great. Everybody's happy right now, happier than we have been in years''

[Law]

They should be more careful then!

[yeah]

They worked on that ~3 months... as it's been said numerous times previously.

[White Wrist]

fast internet connection!

[aj]

I agree with him. Impatience of the masses has killed art.

I for one shall be glad on Friday when I pick up the CD, smell the artwork, analyse the booklet and listen to the album for the first time.

[theis]

Impatience of the masses has killed art.

Truth.

[iceache]

You know , it just popped into my mind.. once albums go 100% digital.. I bet early leaks will stop.

[wondermixx]

You know , it just popped into my mind.. once albums go 100% digital.. I bet early leaks will stop.

that would suck ass man! theres nothing better than having the real deal..

[fetisher]

Impatience of the masses has killed art.

Truth.

Indeed.  I'm guilty of it as well.   

[Urantia23]

fast internet connection!

LOL

They worked on that ~3 months... as it's been said numerous times previously.

right

[Starz]

I for one shall be glad on Friday when I pick up the CD, smell the artwork, analyse the booklet and listen to the album for the first time.

Excuse my ignorance..but how come you get the CD on Friday?

[M1GHTY M4VS]

I for one shall be glad on Friday when I pick up the CD, smell the artwork, analyse the booklet and listen to the album for the first time.

Excuse my ignorance..but how come you get the CD on Friday?

Germany has the release date on April 30 for DE

[raynor]

Impatience of the masses has killed art.

Truth.

Couldn't agree less really. Good music will always be good music and downloading albums has helped me get into pretty much all the bands I listen to today. I don't think Diamond Eyes, or any other album, is more enjoyable when listening though a pair of headphones on your mp3-player or listening to it on a CD.

[Subliminal]

Impatience of the masses has killed art.

Truth.

Couldn't agree less really. Good music will always be good music and downloading albums has helped me get into pretty much all the bands I listen to today. I don't think Diamond Eyes, or any other album, is more enjoyable when listening though a pair of headphones on your mp3-player or listening to it on a CD.

And I couldn't agree more with you.

It's nothing to do with the impatient masses, it's to do with that little cunt who just can't help him/herself and leaks the promo/reviewers copy of the CD they've received. Some of them leak it themselves i.e Trent Reznor. But if anyone is to blame, it's the labels for not doing enough to prevent leaks.

Time to get over it, this is how it is now. If your music is good enough and you're popular, shit, you're going to do well REGARDLESS. If Deftones doesn't kick everyone's asses again this time around, then they only have themselves to blame regarding their previous effort which didn't gain much attention. (I still loved it though)

I think Diamond Eyes is their rebirth, almost every band from the 80s/90s seem to all be having a revolution of their own, despite leaks and all that meaningless shit.

[jesusinabowlofdirt]

subliminal has been arguing for deftones leaking the record themsleves and that it is good for them, and now he is acting like he hasnt and now he is refering to the leaker as a "cunt"...  is this guy for real..

[Subliminal]

The write up is done, sorry about any typos guys. Fucking interesting read! It's a shame Kerrang! has to dramatize the shit out of everything though.

[Moz]

This is one of the best 'Tones interviews ever.

Stuff about Eros, stuff about recording Diamond Eyes, the stuff about Chi... it's enough to get emotional. And very uplifting too: Chino pinpoints exactly what was missing on the previous two records in my opinion. The fact that he flat out states things like 'we weren't trying hard enough' and 'we had to save the band, our career'... it puts them waaaay up in my respect book. wow.

edit: thanks Subliminal, hard work but it's worth it. I don't think Kerrang dramatised it much though, most of the drama is from the mouth of Chino himself.

[fetisher]

Impatience of the masses has killed art.

Truth.

Couldn't agree less really. Good music will always be good music and downloading albums has helped me get into pretty much all the bands I listen to today. I don't think Diamond Eyes, or any other album, is more enjoyable when listening though a pair of headphones on your mp3-player or listening to it on a CD.

Like you, I have been introduced to many a song/album online in <insert forum here>.  Though I don't think that's entirely the point aj was making when he/she said that impatience has killed art.  I could be wrong, however. 

My take on the statement is that our instant-gratification, now-now-now, internet society has (at the very least) without argument destroyed the classic album experience.  Which is kind of sad for those of us old enough to remember sitting at our radio with a cassette tape, finger on record, ready to tape the song you just requested on the radio because the album doesn't come out for another two weeks.  And maybe that was a form of impatience too, but at least it was impatience that you had to fucking work for, as opposed to downloading the full CD quality album a month early in three minutes. 

Sometimes that asshole DJ would never even play your request.   

You know, there is something to be said for waiting for something.  Impatience is not a good quality.  And what's happening in our society, especially with regard to audio releases (and film as well) is that there's this standard being set, for being impatient.  It's become the absolute norm, to expect something to be leaked early.  And I feel like that's just setting a really bad precedent.

There's all this fucking demand for the newest thing.  People's attention spans would put a goldfish to shame, anymore.  And what happens with a situation like that is, someone will see the opportunity to take advantage of the situation.  It's usually some corporation ready to bleed it for all it's worth.  The powers that be (be it production companies, record companies, etc...) are more than obliged to take the reigns.  Create focus groups and establish target audiences.  'Discover' new 'talent' and market and sell them.  They'll identify what will make money and what will not, and they will absolutely flood the market with it.

And I'm not knocking the process.  It's a business, and it serves a purpose.  The real problem is that the demand is there.  That's the unfortunate thing, and the reason why these companies succeed as well as they do.  And it's precisely because of our impatience and insatiable need for something new, that this is able to happen.  When people submit to this behavior as the norm, they sacrifice quality for mediocrity.  They get entertainment, instead of art. 

That is what is destroying art.

And I'm not even knocking mindless entertainment.  Mindless entertainment is great.  But only when it's not at the expense of art.  When it doesn't set a precedent of mediocrity.  You know, when Brittany Spears is known the world over, but only three people I know have ever heard of The Cocteau Twins, that's a bad thing.  It's truly sad, in my humble opinon.

That said, I downloaded DE.  Ha!

I was part of the problem on this one (I typically purchase my music).  But I'm trying to change.   

[fetisher]

This is one of the best 'Tones interviews ever.

Yes, it was.  Nice read.  Thanks for posting.

[Moz]

stuff

nice read.

I once was the ultimate internet consumer. downloading music and movies. then at one point I realised I never really ENJOYED listening or watching something. I always was in a hurry to get to the next thing. same with buying too much games, you dont have time to appreciate the stuff you're playing.

now I only download music to check out new bands that I don't know about. or if I really can't wait for it because it's one of my favourite bands (like the 'Tones). And if I like it I buy it. But I don't buy too much... don't want to oversaturate myself.

put simply, I want to collect stuff, but in a most minimalistic way possible. only the stuff I really want.