i have given this inclination alot of thought recently, and i know some maybe wholeheartedly agree.
i see deftones as shoegaze alt metal.
but i think the shoegaze aspect should be highlighted more;
chino's vocals, high distorition, just very brooding feels to most of their stuff.
i guess this is why so many "metal heads" hate them/dont give them respect, saying they're guitar parts ar "so easy to play" and such n such etc etc...
i always find myself defending them as if they were my child to a wolf, saying its "their style"
and it is.
i lknow im kind of rambling now into something totally different, but im sick of the hate on the tones,
people need to get that its not all about soloing out the whole time.
shoegazer er not,
i love my tones
respect
bless
defined shoegaze?
bullshit. deftones have no shoegaze in their music. no at all
sorry to disappoint you.
but My Bloody Valentine have some
i still feel it.
especially on self titled.
mostly of all due to chino's vocal approach (the singing)
and the high distortion,
in songs like; Anniversary, battle axe, good morning beautiful, dai the flu, bqad, xerces
its mys take wether you see it as "bullshit." or not
wut the hell is shoegaze i never heard that term ever
Blasphemy. They may be influenced by "shoegaze" bands but thats about as far as that shit goes.
ETA shoegaze is like MBV, Jesus and Mary Chain, even the Cure. Kinda edgy dreampop is the best way I can describe the term.
Deftones totally have some elements of shoegaze...but I wouldn't call them shoegaze per se. A lot of their music has that dreamy feel a la my bloody valentine, the cure, depeche mode, etc...who all happen to be major influences on multiple Deftones band members. I suppose deftones show the metal side of shoegaze music. minerva, hole in the earth (chorus/breakdown), wgtb (breakdown), wax and wane (of course - cocteau twins), cherry waves, digibath, rx queen, et al. best exemplify this.
On a broader note, it's hard to typify the Deftones as one certain type of music. They have their moments of almost all genres - punk, metal, electronic, rock, hip/hop, etc...I suppose the only thing missing is a little bluegrass...
Quote from: buddyboy101 on May 10, 2008, 12:19 AM
Deftones totally have some elements of shoegaze...but I wouldn't call them shoegaze per se. A lot of their music has that dreamy feel a la my bloody valentine, the cure, depeche mode, etc...who all happen to be major influences on multiple Deftones band members. I suppose deftones show the metal side of shoegaze music. minerva, hole in the earth (chorus/breakdown), wgtb (breakdown), wax and wane (of course - cocteau twins), cherry waves, digibath, rx queen, et al. best exemplify this.
On a broader note, it's hard to typify the Deftones as one certain type of music. They have their moments of almost all genres - punk, metal, electronic, rock, hip/hop, etc...I suppose the only thing missing is a little bluegrass...
awesome.
very well put. and better than myself...
you clarified it very well.
and i never said they "were" shoegaze, but rather they have some shoegaze in "them" (i really dont see how this acn be denied)
and you def cant put an exact finger on them... they are full of shit! lol
bless
Shoegaze is a genre of alternative rock that emerged from the United Kingdom in the late 1980s. It lasted until the mid 1990s, peaking circa 1990 to 1991.
The British music press (notably NME and Melody Maker) called this genre "shoegazing" because the musicians in these bands often maintained a motionless performing style, standing on stage and staring at the floor while playing their instruments; hence, the idea that they were gazing at their shoes. The shoegazing sound featured extensive use of guitar effects, and indistinguishable vocal melodies that blended into the creative noise of the guitars. Few shoegazers were dynamic performers or interesting interviewees, which prevented them from breaking through into markets in the United States. A lump description given to shoegaze bands in London in the early 1990s was "The Scene That Celebrates Itself." In the 1990s, shoegaze groups were pushed aside by the likes of American grunge and Britpop, forcing bands to breakup or evolve into a different style. Recent times have seen a renewed interest in the genre, among so-called "nu-gaze" bands.
read more here -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoegazing
I totally agree with you on this. I've been thinking about this a lot recently so thats random you had the same thoughts on their true sound that not other metal can or has done. I feel like theyrcan really be described as Metal Shoegaze because thats what it sounds like. A "metal" version/or take on shoegaze. The dragged out singing that started to show really well on ATF. Songs like Lhabia (best shown when singing "Dying of bordem, I'll try it all" from here on he thne goes to the screaming "I'll be faint like a crook. It looks and feels great. But look at what it's doing to you. But thats ok, look how it feels" he is totally singing very dreampop-y. Singing softly layered over with screatching [sp?] no one can do that shit like chino) , Mascara, Dai The Flu, Damone etc tec.
Quote from: cast so cool on May 09, 2008, 10:43 PM
Blasphemy. They may be influenced by "shoegaze" bands but thats about as far as that shit goes.
ETA shoegaze is like MBV, Jesus and Mary Chain, even the Cure. Kinda edgy dreampop is the best way I can describe the term.
Not saying that they are a srtraight up shoegaze band. Its just THEIR style of shoegaze that had obviously influenced the metal sounds.
shoegaze is lush, my bloody valentine, slowdive, ride, chapterhouse, secret shine, swervedriver, airiel, Spiritualized , not the Deftones
Deftones are not a shoegaze band.
They do not fit the original definition.
just because a band has some obvious influence from a certain genre doesn't mean they belong to that genre. if that were the case, we could very well call Deftones thrash metal, grunge, gangsta rap, new wave and post punk too.
What the fuck is shoegaze?
I'dd rather compare Team Sleep with shoegaze bands (for example 'Your skull is red") but absolutely not deftones.
Quote from: deftoneskoen on May 10, 2008, 02:20 PM
I'dd rather compare Team Sleep with shoegaze bands (for example 'Your skull is red") but absolutely not deftones.
yes, that's true
Quote from: aenemic on May 10, 2008, 11:10 AM
just because a band has some obvious influence from a certain genre doesn't mean they belong to that genre. if that were the case, we could very well call Deftones thrash metal, grunge, gangsta rap, new wave and post punk too.
well that's just the point. it's impossible to pin the deftones into any certain genre. they have been described as all of those terms you used to no avail.
Quote from: deftoneskoen on May 10, 2008, 02:20 PM
I'dd rather compare Team Sleep with shoegaze bands (for example 'Your skull is red") but absolutely not deftones.
i agree with the first half of your statement, but still argue their are hints of shoegaze
just google "deftones shoegaze" and you'll come up with a smattering of results of critics and observers who have already found elements of shoegaze within the deftones.
http://www.google.com/search?q=deftones+shoegaze
Quote from: ToniteWeMurder on May 10, 2008, 10:22 AM
shoegaze is lush, my bloody valentine, slowdive, ride, chapterhouse, secret shine, swervedriver, airiel, Spiritualized , not the Deftones
Quote from: bored on May 10, 2008, 10:51 AM
Deftones are not a shoegaze band.
They do not fit the original definition.
Quote from: aenemic on May 10, 2008, 11:10 AM
just because a band has some obvious influence from a certain genre doesn't mean they belong to that genre. if that were the case, we could very well call Deftones thrash metal, grunge, gangsta rap, new wave and post punk too.
dude i swear some people on this board dont even read into the discussion.
like has been said before, nobody said they "WERE" -"all in all" shoegaze.
read
Quote from: Jerry_Curls on May 10, 2008, 07:53 AM
I totally agree with you on this. I've been thinking about this a lot recently so thats random you had the same thoughts on their true sound that not other metal can or has done. I feel like theyrcan really be described as Metal Shoegaze because thats what it sounds like. A "metal" version/or take on shoegaze. The dragged out singing that started to show really well on ATF. Songs like Lhabia (best shown when singing "Dying of bordem, I'll try it all" from here on he thne goes to the screaming "I'll be faint like a crook. It looks and feels great. But look at what it's doing to you. But thats ok, look how it feels" he is totally singing very dreampop-y. Singing softly layered over with screatching [sp?] no one can do that shit like chino) , Mascara, Dai The Flu, Damone etc tec.
Not saying that they are a srtraight up shoegaze band. Its just THEIR style of shoegaze that had obviously influenced the metal sounds.
thank you!
i see some look at this open-mindedly ;)
bless.
I see "shoegaze" a stupid term, the whole idea is so fucking stupid. I know there are good shoegaze bands but... uhm.
and I dont see them as shoegaze, probably like someone said before: they mix a lot of genres, and my fellas, that's what I love about the tones.
I was just reading about shoegazing bands a couple weeks ago. They're bands like Smashing Pumpkins and it started with bands like The Cure and stuff. It is what the name says. It's not a genre of music, it's the act of just staring down at the general direction of your shoes and just mellowing out, playing the guitar. I would say Chino is a shoe gazer
There are definetly elements of shoegaze in Deftones. People who say there isn't probably don't even know what shoegaze is or think that it's shit so they find it hard to believe that Deftones are influenced by these bands... Deftones love Cure, My Bloody Valentine et al so of course this is going to influence the sound which Deftones play...
one goddamnit song... please name at least one deftones song which is shoegaze influenced
Hey man. Just look up Shoegazing on wikipedia.org and you'll see that all the bands Chino was influenced by were involved in that genre of music. They cite terms like "dream pop, , trippy guitar effects, ambience "and indistinguishable vocal melodies that blended into the creative noise of the guitars"". That doesn't sound like deftones to you?
well, that sounds like thousands different bands for me.
i just ask for a song name
In response to the author:
Caricaturisation is what it is...classifying personal expression.....be it music, painting, poetry or word play.....
Caricaturisation is, imo, taking away from intention.
Personal expression should be just that....why look for a box to place it in?
In all honesty...fuck that.
Digital bath is a song that comes to mind when I think of shoegazing and deftones. Pink maggit too. Anything soft and mellow. Like someone said before, there are elements of it in their music , but they're always changing and evolving so it's hard to pin point exactly what deftones are. Anyway I love em and that's why we're here.
Quote from: Zevaka on May 10, 2008, 06:01 PM
one goddamnit song... please name at least one deftones song which is shoegaze influenced
bro - almost all of them! Rats! comes to mind especially when chino's singing all soft and smooth over stephen's agitated riffs during the chorus. Digital Bath for sure, and Hole in the Earth. Even BQAD has that dreamy feel to it. Passenger too.
Deftones.
So masters of dynamics.
Quote from: Zevaka on May 10, 2008, 06:29 PM
well, that sounds like thousands different bands for me.
i just ask for a song name
dude why are you being difficult and getting pissed off, like we offended you.
thats just the thing we already listed atleast an albums worth of songs on the first page of this topic.
didnt you read through it....
i mean i dont know how this can be denied like I and others have said.
Hang on...WTF is shoegaze?
Please don't say it's another lame way to chop music into categories.....
Well I agree about music being an outlet of expression all the way, but it is categorized no matter how hard we try to say it's not. It's like trying to deny diversity itself. I won't get way too into it but yea.
All the info you need is right here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoegazing
Yes. Yes it is. Obviously a lot of bands are influenced by this genre. New bands like No Age come to mind that mixes punk with shoegaze. It's not a crime to label music.
Quote from: Zevaka on May 10, 2008, 06:01 PM
one goddamnit song... please name at least one deftones song which is shoegaze influenced
Dude. You obviously don't read posts because on page 1 I gave some examples of this, but since I'm nice, I'll give another example:
Battle-axe
Right when the drums start to kick in, you can hear some guitar work that Chino prolly does over Stef's to add some density and layering to it. The guitars might be heavier than most of the shoegaze, but it feels like shoegaze has always been heavy [some MBV songs are heavy as fuck like "Feed me with your kiss"]When Chino starts to sing, you can hear it during
"Still maaaaaaking believe.." after every word is just floaty. Dreamy. Dream pop. Shoegaze. At one point in this song, during and after the 2nd chorus, it leads into
"Still you love to think you have always been this way. Well I'd love to think you will someday feel the same. And you love to think it will always...alwaaaaays..." it feels like Chino doesn't stop singing...he just keep on singing without taking a break. Keeps on repeating the word "always" with the repeating guitars in the back, just floating there. Very droned out, spacey, rock. "But you'reee wrrrrooonnnngggg". Dude.
^Word
And here is one of my favorite EPs from My Bloody Valentine; Feed Me With Your Kiss EP
(http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/109/mbvfeedmewithyourkiss9eu.jpg)
http://download.yousendit.com/723EBB2F13E0487E
[edit: I added one more song to the EP.so 3 in total. my bad]
First song is heavy as fuck. The bass gets to me everytime. Punk ass ending. The second song, "I Believe" is one of my favorite MBV tracks. Just super droney, poppy, but not at the same time. During the chorus, you can hear the girl in the back just softly singing, something Chongo has or would do. Love this song. Next song is pretty fucking good as well.
Quote from: cyppe101 on May 10, 2008, 11:23 AM
What the fuck is shoegaze?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoegazing
yes, i completely forgot about Battle-Axe. I agree with it.
but digital bath? Passenger? Lhabia? helll no
Bloody Cape is a weird shoegazing/metal combo that just happens to work brilliantly.
I wanted to type something when this topic was first posted, but I feel like there really isn't anything to add. I definitely agree that they have elements of shoegaze in their music. I feel like that's the basis of their softer stuff.
Quote from: defskull on May 10, 2008, 11:52 PM
I feel like that's the basis of their softer stuff.
That's how ive always seen it as well. And for some reason Dai the flu's chorus always reminds me of Isnt anything times MBW.
i'm sorry i still don't consider any of those songs shoegaze, kinda hard when i grew up with my bloody valentine's loveless and lush's spooky
It's funny, I have been kinda getting into the whole Shoegaze thing with bands like MBV and Slowdive, etc. and I defintely made a corellation between the Tones and Shoegaze. For everyone who is like "wtf is Shoegaze?" just watch a youtube vid of My Bloody Valentine or simply wiki it. Shoegaze was originally a derrogatory term for the genre made by a critic... much like Impressionism was. Shoegaze is simply the tendency of the guitarist/s to look down at the pedals(looks like they are staring at their feet) while playing, hence shoe-gaze.
MINERVA is definetly reminiscent of shoegaze. If you can't see it, then sorry you need to check your ears. whether or not they were influenced by it on that song, idk. And when Deftones play live, Steph is usually always staring down at his guitar pedals. The Deftones ARE NOT shoegaze but are defintely influenced by it. Chino is known for his love of that kind of music and in a magazine article I have he listed MBV's Loveless as one of his fav albums.
Bless
Quote from: emehlen on May 11, 2008, 09:02 PM
MINERVA is definetly reminiscent of shoegaze. If you can't see it, then sorry you need to check your ears. whether or not they were influenced by it on that song, idk. And when Deftones play live, Steph is usually always staring down at his guitar pedals. The Deftones ARE NOT shoegaze but are defintely influenced by it. Chino is known for his love of that kind of music and in a magazine article I have he listed MBV's Loveless as one of his fav albums.
Bless
indeed... indeed.
and Bless.
Quote from: ImperfectCircle on May 10, 2008, 05:13 PM
I was just reading about shoegazing bands a couple weeks ago. They're bands like Smashing Pumpkins and it started with bands like The Cure and stuff. It is what the name says. It's not a genre of music, it's the act of just staring down at the general direction of your shoes and just mellowing out, playing the guitar. I would say Chino is a shoe gazer
sorry mate but you coudnt be more wrong the bands tyhat started it where bands like MBV Ride etc. My Bloody Valentine was the first shoegaze band because basically as you said belinda would look down tpwards her feet as she played but generally the music was very slow and dreamy so I wouldnt say deftones wer shoegaze although White Pony did contain elements & i know chino really likes MBV as iv said in previous posts ill show you...
copy & paste --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1gOxmdBOMI
its all about the dreamyness --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWQWX4xmImA
guys the tones have a wide range of styles you cant just pinpoint one certain sound on them and you cant say that they might/mightnot have a certain sound...the Tones differentiation in music is what makes em great, at best the one catergorie i ever call em is Experimental, these guys have there own fucking genre and regardless if theyre billionaires and platinum winners or not, having your own side of the music scale is an awesome feat in itself.
Quote from: ilovechino69 on May 09, 2008, 10:40 PM
wut the hell is shoegaze i never heard that term ever
you're too easy to pick on. no wonder everyone rips on you
Shoegaze means - They have awsomly cool shoes and people can't help but too gaze/stare at there shoes.
Really its quite a feat. Too be a shoegazed band.
Quote from: wither-I on May 09, 2008, 09:19 PM
i guess this is why so many "metal heads" hate them/dont give them respect, saying they're guitar parts ar "so easy to play" and such n such etc etc...
I've heard the same thing by metal guitar players about deftones. Like its only good if its hard to play... like a video game. Hilarious. And yes there is a hint of shoegaze in deftones' sound especially on SNW.
Quote from: nyquil addict on Jan 04, 2009, 01:22 AM
Quote from: wither-I on May 09, 2008, 09:19 PM
i guess this is why so many "metal heads" hate them/dont give them respect, saying they're guitar parts ar "so easy to play" and such n such etc etc...
Like its only good if its hard to play... like a video game.
haha its so tru people judge music by complexity rather than honest ears too often...
viva la noise!!